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Showing posts sorted by relevance for query dark elves. Sort by date Show all posts
Showing posts sorted by relevance for query dark elves. Sort by date Show all posts

Friday, December 31, 2010

My Perspective on Dark Elves, 1st and 2nd Edition AD&D – Part I

1st edition dark elf art by Bill Willingham
Awesome Bill Willingham art!

(I should start with the fact that I read the first books when they came out that featured Dark Elves by RA Salvatore in 1988 with the first being the Crystal Shard; however as you will see my experience fortunately predates his work by about one year).

Before I get into the particulars of the role-playing genre and dark elves in general, I think I should point out a few things. Unlike most people that started playing the game, I was not a geek or nerd per se. I suspect that some had the same path as me, but not too many. I played sports (football even from the time I was 7-8), had lots of girlfriends even from an early age. So suffice to say I was not the lonely prototypical nerd staying in my basement playing D&D to the exclusion of all else. In fact, some of my girlfriends in high school were downright hot! (what the Hell they were doing with me is another post for another time ;) I might be a geek now, but I digress. So for at least me it blows the angst geek stereotype that wants to play dark elves right out of the water.

Now, with all this said I have a terrible secret: I have played drow characters! Harsh? Fan-boy, I know? Hardly. However, I have only played two in my gaming life of 30 years and both were fun for different reasons.

My first experience with dark elves started with the first AD&D book I bought myself, the much maligned Unearthed Arcana. Contained within the tome, really a collection of Gary Gygax's home campaign notes to a large degree, were expanded rules for demi-human races, including Dark Elves. Funny when I look at it now, the deep gnomes may have even more munchkin rules than the dark elves! The Duergar and the Dark Elves are about neck and neck in my honest opinion.

Playing in one of our last 1st edition D&D campaigns in high school before we switched to 2nd, I decided to play a dark elf fighter/magic-user wielding a spetum and shield to mean effect and casting many a fireball and lightning bolt that crossed his path. This was late 1986/early 1987. I still have his character sheet and looking through his notes he finished at around levels 7/9 for about 2 years of play. His name was Relendor Silkenweb. The main memories I have of playing him was that he was very much a mercenary and approached most obstacles with that mindset.

My second dark elf was from the 90s and was created in early 1997 for a 2nd Edition AD&D campaign. Previously the DM tried to get us to play Basic via the Rules Cyclopedia. For one reason or another the group stopped playing and reformed a few weeks later. I played an elf fighter with a morbid curiosity towards death. With that short-lived character called Cormac in Basic D&D I came up with the idea of my second dark elf character named Yonel Var-Empyr, a dark elf elven knight using a kit from Elves of the Evermeet based off Cormac.

Now how I got to this was a bit weird so bear with me. At the time I was re-reading all of the Elric books and being easy reads I plowed through them all. It was from this third read that I would later form up his back-story. I also remember being influenced by Worf on Star Trek - The Next Generation.

I also chalk some of it up to breaking my leg in thirteen places and being on pain killers for months on end...

With all that said, the character gained a ton of back history and it melded to the history of the game the DM presented. It was quite organic. He eventually became a leader of outcast elves, mainly surface elves at that. The interesting thing is that at either time with either character I can’t say I was influenced by the Dark Elf sagas of Drizzt Do’Urden. Shocking I know? In the first case I looked up some drow names from D3 - Descent into the Depths of the Earth and jumbled something around or dropped some letters. In the second case more Elric influence. Can’t quite remember how I came up with the second name.

So what does this have to do with dark elves per se I hear you say? Nothing and everything. As a player that came in a later wave to D&D and 1st AD&D via the Moldvay boxed set I got for Christmas in 1982, I have a different perspective of TSR and its events relating to dark elves, and the road that led to second edition. I mention these because to many the two are the same thing: dark elves and 2nd edition.

Switching gears a bit: Being 12 in 1985, I only had a vague impression or understanding that Gary Gygax had left TSR and no idea as to all the reasons till many years later. So with this in mind my friends and I had about two years of AD&D under our belts and much of that was figuring out what to do with it and coming up with some munchkin characters that make anything R.A. Salvatore could come up with look tame in comparison.

We noodled around with both Basic and AD&D and blended them together as I am sure a lot of people did. I quit that group and joined another group which is where I played my first dark elf listed above. From there I played with some excellent guys who are still my friends to this day, yes even including the 2nd edition games.

Now cross this with my DMing. In my current gaming group either one other DM and I take the DMing chores. In the times I DM’d I think I have used the dark elves as protagonists exactly once as a minor story arc revolving around a human PC cleric. When it is all said and done my favorite underdark race and one that I often use in my AD&D games is the Derro, another creature that first appeared in 1st edition AD&D...

So thus you have my perspective as a Dungeon Master (I rarely use them) and I have played exactly two dark elves since 1982. Thus the stage is set for my discussion of Drizzt, Dark Elves and 2nd edition AD&D.

So this closes out Part I. I will be starting on Part II soon. That next one is going to really get into the meat if you will, mirroring my analysis of the rise of 2nd Edition and the hated cliché of the Dark Elf character, what the archetype means and how it mirrored TSR.

 


Saturday, January 15, 2011

My Perspective on Dark Elves, 1st and 2nd Edition AD&D – Part II

The source of so much spilled "digital ink."

In a previous post I talked about my personal road and involvement in playing dark elves in Advanced Dungeons and Dragons. I've played one dark elf in 1st edition (around 1986/7) and one in 2nd edition (1997/2000) since 1982; not a bad track record. My dark elf for 1st edition coincided with me purchasing Unearthed Arcana with my own cash which was a huge moment for me. Interestingly enough both coincided with two of the best campaigns I ever played in.

In 1989 the gaming world changed with the introduction of a character by R.A. Salvatore called Drizzt Do’Urden and since then grognards the world over have labeled this event along with Lorraine Williams as the worst things ever to happen to Advanced Dungeons and Dragons (I think it was 3rd and 4th edition that was the worst but that's just me). I fully agree with the Lorraine Williams part, the second, not so much and here's why.

Look at what changed, I mean what really changed. TSR hit a gold mine with what was morphing into a major character that rivaled Spiderman to Marvel Comics. Think about this: at one point in the late 80's there were four Spiderman titles in a month, four! Was he overexposed? Most assuredly, but more to the point Marvel was smart — they were using their most well known property to gain more sales. Smart companies do this and if I was in the same boat I'd probably do the very same thing. So with that realization it was all Drizzt Do’Urden all the time everywhere in the Realms. If this was say for a character from Greyhawk I don't think there would be this much gnashing of teeth this many decades later. Gord anyone?

In a way I don't think anyone can fault TSR for having him appear so much. In this sense Drizzt is no different than Marvel using Spiderman as their poster boy and the parallels are somewhat similar as to why they were so popular:

  • Loners (by and large)
  • Both misunderstood by the "public at large"
  • Both intrinsically good, despite those they protect not understanding them

By and large this probably describes large numbers of teenage boys who probably formed the largest readership of the character. I don't look down on anyone who might make their teenage years easier — one knows they are hard enough as it is.

So with all that said what makes Drizzt whiny and not Peter? I really don't think either are personally but maybe that's me. I think much like Ravenloft, Dragonlance's D1-15 and Drizzt it's a case of people's impression of them that means "this is so" rather than what it might actually be. Look through Dragonlance, some think its "rail-roady", sure it is to a point but that's what happens when you mirror a series of books and vice-versa. Peter could be pretty darn whiny, especially in the early days. Rarely does Drizzt's mask slip, it may have later as I stopped reading the series after Siege of Darkness.

I think the problem that exists for the old time gamers is the fact that it changed the idea of Dark Elves very much from what Gary Gygax imagined them in the Fiend Folio and D1-3 the Drow Series (the companion to the Giant Series G1-3). 

The problem I have with that is that what was Gary imagining from exactly? Traditionally Dark Elves were a Norse idea and I see some direct influence there. If one looks at the literary sources of say Tolkien, his dark elves are those that never beheld the Light of the Trees of Valinor, again something very different. I like Gary's imagining in D3- Vault of the Drow as opposed to say the City of Menzoberranzan boxed set (circa 1992) but both have merits. Newer school players are probably bound to like the latter. Doesn't mean that either is wrong, but in over two decades of gaming archetypes are bound to change. Whether they want to admit it I'm guessing that the people consuming the media and games have changed as well.

Another problem I see with this over-arcing theme of dark elves is that once someone played in or read G1-3, and D1-3 the cat was largely out of the bag anyways. It's not like you can stuff that particular genie back in the bottle again. Then the issue was compounded with the explosion of Salvatore's writing and the Forgotten Realms shifting to the default campaign setting for Advanced Dungeons and Dragons. I think this also speaks to a larger problem as well: the politics of TSR, the ouster of Gary and the fact that second edition was starting to become more and more of a reality to the older generation of Advanced Dungeons and Dragons gamers. This lead to a massive schism that still reverberates today which I won't delve into here.

Expounding on this further then brings to nature of the character Drizzt. Many of the old guard simply label him as a munchkin character that is over the top and breaks the rules of the game. That may be so, but if anything he fits better rules-wise in 1st edition, and after all 1st edition allowed for the playing of dark elves as characters by none other than Gary... It's important to note that while I'm a big fan of Greyhawk in terms of a campaign setting (with all its clunky weirdness that goes hand in hand with it) it's not like the World of Greyhawk is not without its munchkin characters either: Again, Mordenkainen and the Circle of Eight anyone? So when you throw all of this together a rather combustible mix is starting to brew.

So why might that be? I think Drizzt also came about at a certain time (the late 80's/early 90's) that were much different than the 70's and what the gamers then grew up with in terms of reading. Keep in mind reading being the primary mode for the transmission of these ideas or by mail ;) In some cases the older generation of gamers and wargamers grew up with the likes of Buck Rogers, Flash Gordon and such. Harryhausen's movies were also likely to be big in their formative years. For the newer gamers and the ones that straddled that line (like me) we were exposed to a wide variety of things and to us our first introduction to say Conan was through a movie rather than the books. I guess what I'm trying to say here is that the character-type is different than the player. The player identifies with the character, but is the character type tainted by the player type? I wonder if some of the "good" drow syndrome was related to the "Worf syndrome"; surely there had to be some Klingons that weren't rat bastards? right? (Don't look at me I liked the Romulans better, even though Worf may have influenced one of my dark elves...)

If the argument that the character of Drizzt attracts a certain type of player, then I would agree with that and that is where the problem lies. Looking over multiple forums that cater to multiple editions this is the sense I get. It would seem that many old-schoolers are continually beset with new school players wanting to play drow rangers dual wielding scimitars. I doubt that's the case for everyone, but lets go with it for a moment. If that's the case then I count myself lucky as I've never had to deal with that in my group. While this maybe is indeed a problem, I can certainly understand why someone would want that escape. We play this game as a means of escape if only for a little while. What many younger players might want is an escape for any number of reasons where they are victims of their surroundings per say or things that are terrible in their regular everyday lives. Its easy to sit back and disparage kids for wanting to play out some fantasies of not being the victim and the butt kicker, to give it out rather than have to take it. I see nothing wrong with that. Some will counter with: "What about the 40-year guys doing this?" Well is that a problem with the character/stereotype they want to play, or that type of player? I'd say the latter.

So how does one reconcile the imagery of dark elves in this day and age? I'm not sure you can. Because it's reached such a level in the gaming community especially the Dungeons and Dragons community that it's a touch-point for certain factions. I'm not going to worry about Dungeons and Dragons 3.0, 3.5 or 4 because they represent such a departure for what many consider Advanced Dungeons and Dragons that it's largely irrelevant to the people that would be playing the older editions of the game. As I noted on Dragonsfoot the first order of business to reclaim the dark elves (if that is indeed your aim) is at once the easiest and toughest: no Dark Elf PCs. This might cause an uproar in your group depending on the players, but then you don't have to worry about the "Drizzt Syndrome" of certain types of players wanting to play him. 2nd point: return them to being monsters of an unknown quality rather than known the world over; think about it in this sense:

  • In the Forgotten Realms - Dark Elves are evil, wicked and downright sadistic. All over the Realms people know they are evil, have heard of them etc. But how is this so for such a "rare" race? Seems like plenty of the common folk have plenty of advanced knowledge of deep underground races. Unless this is of course because they raid so often?
  • In the World of Greyhawk Dark Elves are evil, wicked and downright sadistic. People know they are evil, but yet at the same time barely know of them... How can either of these be?

In a pseudo medieval setting most people are going to have extremely limited knowledge of really ancient legends. Dark elves fall in that category. They are going to be worried about farming, winters and "real" monsters like goblins, orcs, hobgoblins and ogres; the ones that they do know of and probably have seen with their own eyes. So how would most folk hate and fear them if they are that rare?

The answer is that the imagery of dark elves is so muddled in Advanced Dungeons and Dragons that you have to separate out just what they are. Or at least separate player expectation. The DM needs to make a decision of how they are presented in his world. Are they mysterious and unknown? If so it stands to reason that most people would have no idea what they are if they saw one and certainly would have no idea of them being the "bogey-man" race that they are presented as. The Forgotten Realms is more guilty of this than Greyhawk per se. In Greyhawk the dark elves are largely unknown and I think the less a DM allows them the better off things will be.

Lolth, 3rd edition art of the demon/drow lesser goddess.
For 3rd edition art, not too bad.
Another benefit of making them unknown is that it eliminates one of the main role-playing reasons why someone might want to play a certain drow ranger clone: if people aren't going to automatically want to kill them on sight it negates the tragic hero angle right off the bat. If the default meme of the last twenty years is gone, what incentive is there for these players to play the same thing they read about? There isn't and there is the beauty of it: they can then be free to play their dark elf as something else, not what they read in a book.

Dark elves do not have to be a touch point like they have been prior, they can be more of what they used to be. It merely takes more effort than it used to.

With all that said, I'm looking forward to writing my first dark elf inspired adventure and for 1st edition Advanced Dungeons and Dragons rules no less. It will be a replacement for Q1 - Queen of the Demonweb Pits, it's very much in need of a better ending and hopefully I can deliver. UPDATE: not long after I started it was noted on Dragonsfoot that someone already done the work: Skein of the Deathmother by John A. Turcotte. Well, that saved time!

In closing for my own part I'm fairly neutral in this as I grow older, having played two dark elf characters since 1982 hardly makes me a fan-boy for them as in both cases it was what my inner muse whispered at the time. I guess playing Warhammer also affected how I viewed dark elves as well as the imagery there is a whole 'nother discussion in and of itself.

Oh and one last thing from D3 by none other than Gary Gygax:  

"In the right hand cage there is a dark elf fighter/magic-user of 4th/4th (HP: 24, no armor, 12 strength, 18 intelligence, 9 wisdom, 18 dexterity, 15 constitution, 13 charisma) placed into captivity yesterday and paralyzed by the spider demoness. He is Nilonim, a dissident Drow captured in Erelhei-Cinlu where he led a band of rebels attempting to overthrow noble rule. He is of neutral alignment with a slight tendency towards good deeds."  

Interesting stuff, were the seeds for the explosion of good Drow contained within? I'm not saying Gary intended anything by this, but it had to have been in there for some reason.

Sunday, July 27, 2014

The coolest monster in AD&D- Derro

Despite the fact that the game is called Dungeons and Dragons; Dragons are not the coolest monster in the Monster Manual/Monstrous Manual. The title instead goes to the...

DERRO!
"Scrawny, pale, little psychos", that is a great appellation for the race!

Scrawny- (from the Monstrous Manual): "Derro are one of the most dexterous of humanoid races (averaging 15-18), and their Armor Class must be adjusted for this." Usually, those that are dextrous are not depicted as hulking brutes...

Pale- (from the Monstrous Manual): "Derro are short, with skin the color of an iced over lake (white, with bluish undertones), sickly, pale yellow or tan hair (always straight), and staring eyes that have no pupils." When one considers most dwarfs in AD&D that's certainly off the beaten path.  

Psychos- (from the Monstrous Manual): "The derro have made a name for themselves by their marked cruelty. It is said that a derro lives for just two things: to witness the slow, humiliating death of surface demihumans, and especially humans; and the perversion of knowledge to their own dark ends." And? they are chaotic evil to boot. 

Tired of dark elves being overdone, "angsty" and lame? Throw them out the window or at least out of the Underdark. That's basically what I've done with my "legendary" World of Galena. (1) With the derro in place there is no need for namby-pamby dark elves. In all seriousness I like dark elves just fine, I just find them overdone or at least the cat is out of the bag when one considers "the big reveal" of G3- Halls of the Fire Giant King. Most often I do not feature dark elves in my games and usually steer players away from them, I'd otherwise they prefer they play gnome illusionists (1). Thus enter the derro.

Derro are a creation of Gary Gygax and first make their appearance in S4- The Lost Caverns of Tsojcanth. It is possible that the derro are based on "deros" in the stories of Richard Sharpe Shaver which appeared in Amazing Stories, a pulp mag from the 1940s. Given that Gary didn't elaborate too much on this I'm inclined to believe the probable origin. Also given Gary predilections towards pulp for his sources and the fact that he was a well-read man? More then likely for their origin.

Whats not to like? To start with from the strategic level, derro are very scalable. I think one of the most overlooked aspects of them is a DM could use them not just at low levels, but at high levels as well. As the PCs rise start throwing some derro with class levels at them, have them tote out more charmed umber hulk and other various slaves. Spell casting via the higher level savants is another boon and an effect that the DM can use strategically.

At the tactical level Derro, properly used can be tough to combat, taken from short companion guide I threw together a few years back called "The Menace of the Derro" here are some of their main high-level tactical pros:
  • 30% Magic Resistenace
  • Small in size (S); this is not an obvious advantage, but they may take less damage from certain weapons; plus not being large creatures they do not take large damage obviously. This is of prime importance as the character rise in levels. An ancillary benefit to their size is the fact that unless the group is entirely composed of dwarves they are going to have a hard time using derro sized weaponry and armor; selling these items is fine, but this has the practical effect of them having lots of high powered armor. This functions in a manner similiar to how Gary gave the dark elves magic items without having worrying about the PCs having tons of extra magical items.
  • Automatically possess the Blind Fighting proficiency due to superior hearing (see above). Additionally due to their keen hearing a derro of any HD may Hear Noise as a thief, with a 10% chance per Hit Die, example a 3 HD derro may hear noises with a base chance of 30%. A secondary function of this ability is that all derro possess the sound analysis proficiency from the 1st edition Dungeoneer’s Survival Guide. With this, derro are very difficult to surprise.
  • They are cunning and intelligent in combat; play them as such.
  • Savants have genius level intelligence use that as well.
  • Savants have spell-casting capabilities; these are increased in my campaign world.
  • Savants can use any magical item, even if they don’t know command words (where applicable).
  • Savants can have weird magical effects to their spells; feel free to make them unusual
  • All derro savants and apprentice savants can instinctively use read magic and comprehend languages an unlimited number of times per day.
    Derro high level savants will often have 2d4 Umber Hulks as servants through charm monster spells. 
In terms of Cons or negatives? There are only a few:
  • Only have a Movement rate of 9; players will most often be able to outrace them.
  • Infravision is only 30’; lowest of all the underground races.
  • Derro are chaotic evil; As such they can be prone to the strife this alignment is known for. Another issue to consider is if your PCs have a paladin and he gets the inevitable holy avenger...
  • Sunlight- the effects of sunlight are vague in the 2nd edition Monstrous Manual. However Dragon #241 has a much more complete discussion of effects: All derro are nauseated by direct sunlight touching their skin, losing 1 hit point per hour of exposure and suffering a -2 to all combat rolls, defensive adjustments, and saving throws while exposed. Hit-point losses are slow to heal if curative magic is not used; only 1 hit point per day maximum will be healed by complete rest, so a derro left outdoors will lapse into a coma and die after a few days of a condition resembling heatstroke. All spells and magical powers that duplicate prolonged sunlight (such as continual light) have this same effect, though the light spell, flashes of bright light, and normal bonfires, torches, and lanterns do not.
Although they are ambushing types, with their weird effective weapons, magic resistance and a host of other abilities and tactics to boot the are tough customers. Derro also have great unique weaponry in the derro repeating crossbow with poison bolts, a specialized hook-fauchard,  and aklys (which is useful in cramped, underground settings). They can also be beefed up by tooling up the "elites", that's what I call the derro sons and daughthers taht comprise 10% of any derro war party armed with heavier armor, spears and military picks (although I'd have them use the hook-fauchard).

All in all, these monsters are bad-ass. On top of that they got their own box set, the Night Below. That's enough for a adventure and a campaign setting all in one. Need a review of Night Below? Here is a pretty balanced one. Derro appear in a number of modules and articles, here are but a few (this is by no means complete):
    • Dungeon #20 “The Ship of Night”
  • Dungeon #44 “Train of Events”
  • Dungeon #79 “Cloudkill”
  • Dragon #241 “Legacies of the Suel Imperium”
  • Greyhawk Ruins
  • WGA3- Flames of the Falcon
  • From the Ashes- Greyhawk boxed set
  • Doomgrinder

Another great point about the derro? They appear in the best module of all time: UK4 When a Star Falls. I think I might need to write up a blog post about that, my favorite monster and my favorite module? "Two great tastes that go great together." (3)

So to recap. Your players lamenting the drow and you need a different race to take their place in you games? Look no further then the derro. I also think that properly panned out, a TPK could very easily be accomplished in my not so humble opinion.

Another great avenue is that they hate humans and demi-humans this gives them even more reasons to be raiding on the surface then the deep dwelling dark elves. Throw in that a local communcity of derro are undergoing a Uniting War and a lot of upheavel can be thrown into a campaign, of which the PCs can be stuck in the middle of. Couple this with the events of Kingdom of the Ghouls in Dungeon #70 and a DM has all of the Underdark political intrigue he could want.

(1) If you know anything about me you know how much I like illusionists or gnomes, or both...

(2) In joke- as in Dwimmermount is/was "legendary" (chortle).

(3) Hey I was a pre-teen in the 80s? What do you expect?

Sunday, March 5, 2017

My journey (back) into 3rd Edition and the rebirth of my Wood Elves

Now that my Chaos Dwarf force is complete (for the most part) I decided to really start painting/repainting my other armies. But before that...

In the past I described how around 1987-89 my high school buddies and I played some amazing AD&D games and a bit later some Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay which I outlined here.

As we transitioned to the later grades in high school we started playing Warhammer Battle, at the time 3rd Edition. For some reason my buddies started playing the game earlier than I. As I would later learn they all picked  different armies so they could ally with each other for larger games. As I recall it was a follows: Jeff- Orcs and Goblins, Dave- Skaven, Pete- Dark Elves, Mike- Goblins? and Daryl had a small Chaos Force featuring Chaos Snakemen. For the most part when I started playing everyone else had largely stopped except Jeff and Dave.

As you can see all of the evil armies were taken except for Undead which didn't appeal to me. So as I started out I briefly played one game with my army as Bretonnian force before converting it to an Empire force. At some point I may post pictures of my Empire army but not now.

So what does this have to do with Wood Elves I hear you say? Glad you asked. Since there was only three of us playing regularly, if we all wanted to play it would be Jeff and Dave vs me! So with an Empire force, what to do? I had to buy and paint my own allies and hence where my Wood Elves came from. In fact my Wood Elf force which would grow to about 1500 pts was just that, an ally contingent that got bigger and bigger. I'm guessing Games Workshop did this but design... Later, my High Elf army would take the same path until it got to be massive, far larger than the Empire force.



I really haven't set out to repaint my wood elves this last month of so, I was repainting my dark elves, but for some reason I stripped down the Wood Elves and started them up with a unit that was one of my original Wood Elf purchases: a unit of 20 archers from the Warhammer Regiment Box set. I think searched the web, not a lot out there in the way of 3rd Edition Wood Elf minis (painted and presented) that is.

As you can see above I repainted them entirely in traditional greens like their original paint jobs, but wanted to make them look very autumnal. So I stopped at the craft store for some Woodland Scenics clump foliage- Fall mix for the bases and the movement tray. For the first try it's a tad too clumpy despite getting the handle of cutting the foliage it with my x-acto as I went.

So stay tuned for further updates about the rebirth/repainting of my Wood Elf Host. Unlike my Dark Elf army underway at the Oldhammer Forums I think I'm going to keep all my Wood Elf updates here on the blog.

Sunday, June 25, 2017

Warhammer 3rd edition, back to the best edition- Part II

As I outlined here I've really returned to my roots as it were in regards to Warhammer. Unlike the ass-hats of the OSR movement on the D&D side however I bear no malice or ill-will towards anyone who plays a different version of Warhammer than I do. I find their "your fun is wrong" statements amusing if nothing else. And with the demise of the traditional rule-set of Warhammer Fantasy Battle this is more pronounced with folks going either the Age of Sigmar route, 9th Age or Return of Kings.

For me its why bother? Yes its cumbersome, but with the good olde' orange rule book and Warhammer Armies you have all you need to play a great game.

Talk about value on this thing: It has 11 of the 12 armies contained within (Norse appeared in White Dwarf #107). In addition there are new rules for war machines, and great rules in my opinion for allies and mercenaries which Warhammer always seemed to struggle with to find a good balance for.

So with that in my mind here is where I stand for each of the armies and potential future plans:

Dark Elves- When complete they will total around 4,000-5,000 points. Details on the progress of the army can be found here. For the most part I largely have all the minis needed and just need to round out a few here and there to fill up certain units rank and file. They also have 25 hobgoblins as allies which I'm looking forward to painting (see below).

Wood Elves- As I've been outlining here on the blog they will come in around 4,000 points when complete. Like Dark Elves these pointy ears are a repaint of my existing models. As I also noted, they originally served as allies for my Empire force, but over the years I collected enough to field a force in their own right.

Almost all the models are 3rd edition ones with a few 4th edition ones mixed in like the Glade Guard serving as Kin Band warriors. 
One of my most heavily converted dragons, circa 2006

High Elves- This will be tougher. Not because I don't have minis but because I have a force of at least 10,000 points of High Elves painted and another 4,000 points unpainted... But they are a 5th edition force in composition and models. This isn't a problem per say, but I'm not going to convert them back to 3rd, but rather leave them as is. Easy enough to play 3rd edition games with them, but unlikely to get a lot of the 3rd edition/4th edition range save for two: one being that ever elusive Elven Attack Chariot (for me).

The Empire- Actually my second army in 3rd Edition (more on that in a bit). Like my High Elves these guys are more configured for 4th-7th than 3rd edition. The good news its easy enough to use them in 3rd edition which I did in a battle around December.

Bretonnia- When I first played 3rd Edition I played my initial force as a Bretonnian force... Now I I can't stand Bretonnia due certain posters on a website that promotes them (you know the one). Ever wonder why the Word of Hashut #10 is the way it is? There you go. Right now I have a mixed force that is probably around 1,000 points. I don't really see my doing anything with them anytime soon.

I will be finishing up a Bretonnian canon however as it was one of my first mini purchases ever. Maybe even a small scenic base too. 

Chaos- My chaos force is largely done. it dates back to 1991 and sports a lot of original paint jobs from that time. As of late I've been splitting out the 5th/6th edition minis from the earlier ones. One "new" unit is a repaint of chaos warriors on foot. Right now I have 16 and have been scoping out the remaining 4. Highly unlikely to field 20 at once as the point cost would be over 1,000 points, but they will look cool none-the-less.

A unit of 25 Beastmen with some gors from 5th/6th and Talisman plastic Beastmen is also "under the brush", but back burner right now. 

Skaven- As my buddy Dave collected them way back when he got all of them from the joint plastic regiment boxes. As a result of this over they years they never had much appeal. I'd say I have 10-20 plastic ones. I could see a unit or two for allies, but I'm highly unlikely to gather a full force especially when one considers the amount of minis needed to field a Skaven force.

Orcs- From my Chaos Dwarfs force I've got more than enough to field a Orc and Goblin force but not too many in the way of 3rd edition minis. If I did I'd be looking for the orc and goblin war-machines to round it out. Hell I might just get them anyways as the minis are so cool.

Dwarfs- Like the Wood Elves the Dwarfs are an outgrowth of needing allies for my Empire force in larger battles (as I was the only one playing the "good armies".) The Dwarfs are the force I've changed the least over the years. What I have done is add more minis to them. The leftover from the Battle for Skull Pass box set have also made their way to the army. Right now I have four units to go with the 6,000 points of painted minis I already have. They were also the first force I thought of painting in a coherent scheme rather than individuals except for one unit where I purposely painted each mini different. As a result the unit is a miss mash of colors but the army is predominately green and yellow. All in all the force works.

Slann- Ahhh Slann. I have zero Slann minis unfortunately and I think I only ever actually saw a few in person painted (Dave had some). For some reason they were fairly hard to come by in the States in the late 80s and to try and collect them now? $$$

Undead- This will be a bit easier. Due to summoning spells in 3rd edition WFB everyone had a Undead plastic box set. Because of this I have one unit of cavalry, one unit of infantry and some extras. Coupled with the zombie plastic box set from 6th means I have the nucleus of a small force but needs some touching up on the first two. At some point I envision a small force along the lines of the ones presented around White Dwarf #142ish.

"Extras"
Norse- Only appeared in White Dwarf #107 and I have to say it let me with a meh feeling for the army. I have a few scattered Norse minis, but don't see myself undertaking this task for another human army largely composed of  infantry. Don't get me wrong the minis are cool, but where are the Norse riding war mammoths???

Nippon- My attempts at Nippon have been on again and off again as the mood strikes me. Now not a 3rd edition force the army list for 2nd could be modified to work with 3rd. I have a sizable force but its going to take a lot more time and a lot more lead. I do have almost every ninja model from the range which is kinda cool!

I think if I could get 1-4 of those damn Temple Dogs it would help!

Mercenaries and Allies- based on having so many armies I can usually field any allies needed. In terms of the mercs? I have the following:
  • Chaos Allies- both chaos dwarf war machines, a mortar and multiple bazukas!
  • Old Worlder Ally contingent- toyed with the idea of converting my Bret force to this contingent.
  • Halflings- Got a fair amount of these for a small ally force. 
  • Giants- Two giants, one old school.
  • Ogres- Unit of 8 detailed here.
  • Half-Orcs- this is going to be a quest. I want the 2nd edition range which goes for $$$ on eBay. 
  • Hogoblins- 25 old school hobgoblins including Baron Brightgore on the painting table!
That about rounds out where I stand in Oldhammer, a lot done, quite a bit to go by that's the fun of it. 


Monday, December 17, 2018

Part VIII of the Repainting my 3rd Edition Wood Elf Force

I've actually been busy in real life as well as with Warhammer stuff. Over the last few months I've done lots of work on my Dark Elf force along with my wood Elves I've been chronicling here on the blog. Interestingly I've been working on the Wood Elves in the autumn and the Dark Elves in the echoing their basing choices.

Quick aside: the progress on the Dark elves can be found here. I'll have some new photos up soon of their progress.

As we all know, Wood Elf forces in 3rd Edition Warhammer are heavy with bow armed troops. This also carried over to later editions. In 3rd the compulsory choices are archers of which the minimum to field is 30. Aside from my Skarloc Wood Elf Archers all the bow armed units in the army are the result of the PBS3 -Plastic Warhammer Regiment Boxed Set. I know I've said it before, but while not the best miniatures that GW ever produced they are some of the best value around, even now as everyone and their brother has some spare ones to sell on E-Bay or trade. Additionally, to me at least these "looks like Warhammer to me" in much the same way 3rd Edition Talisman "As I know it."

So with all this here are the units I've completed, not one but two units, 20 strong of Wood Elf archers. As you can see green predominates but I continued with the black and white accenting to tie them into the other units of the army, along with the autumnal basing or red, orange and yellow. This now brings the fire power up to 82; three units with 20 and the Skarloc Archers having 22 in the regimental box set.

The 2nd unit (2nd as in I pictures the first unit here and Skarloc's counts as unit #1 for my army) followed by the 3rd.
















































To close out, I'll also need to get pictures up of my Elven Attack chariot that I painted up for the Wood Elf force, it came out well and I realized I finished it several months back. I now have a sizable force of Wood Elves repainted and have come a long way when they were simply an Ally force for my mega-battle with Dave and Jeff.


Friday, November 21, 2025

I Painted the Dwarf Allies…And Broke Warhammer Allies (1988)- Part I

From White Dwarf #108: "Eradicated Gremlins GW? More like they lived on for nearly 40 years."

There I was, happily painting up a Dwarf Ally Contingent from the 3rd Edition Warhammer Armies Book from 1988. I had a handful of figures left over from my six thousand point Dwarf army, so it felt like an obvious project. This also tied into my larger plan. I have been trying to collect all eleven armies in the book (Norse from White Dwarf #107 eventually too) and every Ally and Mercenary Contingent, each with its own dedicated set of miniatures.

As noted on the blog previously, years ago, I consolidated and rebuilt my Dwarf Mercenary force using leftover Battle for Skull Pass figures from the later editions. Even after that, I still had extra metal models from the period, along with plastic Dwarfs from the old Warhammer Regiment box set. You know how this hobby goes. A few Quarrelers, some Ironbreakers, a hero, and you think you are ready to field a proper contingent. That was the plan, at least. I was wrong.

While I was finishing the Dwarf Warrior unit, the question hit me. “Okay, who can actually take these guys?”

It seemed simple. Open Warhammer Armies from 1988, check the ally lists, match these stout warriors to the army that could field them, and move on with the project.

Except this is where the wheels came off: no one can take them. Not one of the eleven armies in the book.

  • Not Empire.
  • Not Bretonnia.
  • Not even the Dwarfs themselves.
  • No Army AT ALL.

That could not be right, or so I thought. But it was. By painting a simple ally contingent, I had stumbled onto one of the most quietly funny and completely uncorrected design mistakes in the entire 3rd Edition era.

The best part? It was right there in plain sight for thirty seven years and nobody ever noticed. ETA (12/3/25): turns out despite my best efforts to source this out, someone else did notice! So no shame here, credit where credit is due! Oldhammer discussion

How I Found the Break Point
After rereading each army entry and its allowed ally list, I decided to reverse the logic.

Rather than asking “What allies can this army take?”
I asked a different question. “Which armies can take these allies?”

I doubt Games Workshop ever approached it this way. I will talk more about that in Part II. I went contingent by contingent and built a full matrix. As the list grew, the pattern became obvious. Army after army had nothing but empty space under the Dwarf Allies category. The Dwarf Ally entry is fully written, fully pointed, and laid out just like every other valid contingent, but no army in the book is actually permitted to use it.

I still did not believe it. So I checked my notes again and kept cross checking online. The result never changed. I even checked the Norse list from White Dwarf #107, which is an official 3rd Edition army. They cannot take Dwarf Allies either.

Then I pulled out both of my copies of the Army Book, the hardcover and the softcover. The same gap appears in both. I will come back to that in more detail in Part II.

Surely This Was Fixed in an Errata?

That was my next thought. I went straight to the web to look for it. This had to be a known issue. I expected to find a long forgotten White Dwarf sidebar, a footnote, a FAQ, a designer comment, or something buried on an old website. Anything at all.

There was nothing.

So I turned to the two White Dwarf issues that are always cited as containing the 3rd Edition corrections for Warhammer Armies from 1988.

And guess what?

Still nothing. Not a single word about Dwarf Allies. Those errata entries only address small housekeeping items. They mainly correct point values and attribute scores for Dark Elves and Skaven. The Dwarf Ally issue is not mentioned anywhere.

The only conclusion I could reach is that the Dwarf Ally Contingent was and still is completely orphaned. It is a dead entry in Warhammer Armies from 1988, and none of us caught it. I have handled that book thousands of times and never noticed it.

And now that I see it, the whole thing feels right in line with the era.

The Most Oldhammer Thing Possible

Welcome to 3rd Edition, where Chaos mutations contradict their own points formula, where Fimir somehow ally with Norse in ways no scholar of fantasy biology can explain, where Nippon mercenaries can be taken only by Dark Elves for reasons known only to the gods, and where the best way to understand the rules is to accept that nobody in 1988 was paid enough to cross index the ally matrix.

This is peak Oldhammer. Creative, chaotic, brilliant, flawed, and absolutely perfect all at once.

Why I Never Noticed This in the ’80s, Even Though I Used Allies

I used allies all the time during the 3rd Edition years. Wood Elves, High Elves, Halflings and Norse saw plenty of table time for me, but I never once used the Dwarf Allies. That alone explains why this flaw stayed hidden from me for almost forty years.

There was another reason as well. Everyone else in my group had started playing before I did, and we had a simple rule. No one could play the same army. I took Empire because it was still open. That choice dictated the allies I reached for. When I looked at Dwarfs, my attention went straight to the four dwarf cannons from the Dwarf Mercenary Contingent. That was the obvious path for an Empire player.

The Dwarf Ally Contingent itself did not help matters. There is nothing in it that you cannot already get from the main Dwarf army list:


  • 1 Contingent Commander
  • 0–40 Dwarf Crossbowmen
  • 0–10 Ironbreakers (really, what are you doing with just ten???) 
  • 10–80 Dwarf Warriors (that's like a whole army!)

It is a perfectly serviceable group of troops, but nothing that would tempt a player who had better and more cost effective options elsewhere. 

So What Now?

Well, in my case?

I fixed the oversight in my own matrix I created. Dwarfs are available to Empire and Bretonnia and Dwarfs themselves as Allies (see here).

But the real fun was the discovery itself. I set out to paint a few allies… and in the process, I broke Warhammer Armies (1988). I didn’t just paint Dwarf Allies. I painted a glitch in the game’s original source code.

Not bad for a weekend project.

Saturday, August 19, 2017

Part VI- Repainting the Wood Elf Force- The Dragon Rider

Back after a ton of summer activities with the kids. While all those activities were going on I wasn't complacent in terms of painting. In fact for summertime painting I got quite a bit done.

This next guy, the ever cool Dragon Master from the Citadel range (notes here). Like the rest of the Wood Elf force this particular model was purchased not for a Wood Elves per say, but yes, you guessed it: an ally for my Empire force in 3rd edition. This purchase represented the start of my High Elf force  which in years would number 14,000 pts. I quickly painted the model up and his debut was against Jeff and Dave's forces (Orc and Goblins/Skaven respectively) during the Ice Storm of 1991 at Dave's house. Since it was just me on the other side I played a combined Empire, Wood Elf and High Elf force. I don't remember too much other than we setup the board on the front living room floor as the power was still out, nor who won. I do recall however they were conspiring to knock him out early, as in like round 1. So against all odds I won initiative and charged across the board and got him into hand-to-hand combat. Don't remember what happened after that, but pretty sure I spoiled their casting of Windblast or Hurricane.

After that Jeff more or less stopped playing so Dave and I played a lot more. This particular dragon would end up as a general for my High Elf force, joined by another Dragon Master model as the army standard bearer and 4 more dragons. The cool thing about the High Elf force in 3rd edition is you could field a force made entirely of dragons which I did a few times. The downside was at 315 points the +4 Shock Elite Dragonkin riders only had 1 Wound...

After moving to 4th and 5th the model sat for a bit until I stripped it of paint and redid it into the form you see now. I made the butterfly wings from regular painting canvas that I cut out to the right shapes and stiffened with successive coats of a watery glue. A small wire forms the leading wing edge to give it additional support. The odd thing was that I modeled a saddle and plunked a 4th edition Empire Rieksguard knight on it  Not sure if the mini ever saw combat in that form.

Since getting back to Oldhammer I've been reassigning models to their proper place in the army lists and it just didn't really fit with the Empire, but I didn't want to trash the dragon. So I touched up the paint job and put the original elf warrior and saddle back on. Upgraded the base to a 50mm base and Bam, done. Moral of the story? Never throw anything away!

So with all that he really wouldn't fit into my High Elf force either with its blue and white paint jobs. What better place to assign then my reborn Wood Elves? Adding fall foliage and once again ties it all back in. 

Next up? I'm still looking for 9 more wood elves from the plastic Warhammer Regiments set for two more archer units (I have 31 now, so two units of 20 is the goal). I did pick up 2 more 4th edition Glade Guard models which I'm using for my Kinband Warriors. I don;t know why but I like these models a lot. They might very well be next as I now have 2 archer units, 1 wardancer unit, a wizard, general, treeman and now dragon rider painted. the force continues to be reborn!

Adding to all of this I'm also working on my reborn 3rd edition Dark elf force and have just finishes a unit of 10 Dark Elf Dark riders. (and yes, you can see some "under the brush" Cold One Knights in the background).

So stay tuned.

Tuesday, November 18, 2025

The Word of Hashut, A Look Back - Part I

 

(With apologies to Conan the Barbarian, 1982)

Between the time before social media and the rise of the sons of Hashut, there was an age undreamed of. And unto this came Willmark, destined to bear the burden of the Word of Hashut upon a troubled brow. It is I, his chronicler, who alone can tell thee of his saga. Allow me to speak of the days of the ezine era!

I had more hair back then...

In the early 2000s, Games Workshop was a slumbering behemoth, and a few armies were abandoned in the wilderness. Chaos Dwarfs were cast into darkness; Dogs of War wandered the fringes of the Borderlands with no marching orders; Warhammer players scoured the world for scraps of lore like exiles clutching broken tablets.

From this desolation came a spark.
That spark became the Word of Hashut: a fanzine forged in the deep furnace of the Dawi Zharr’s will. A magazine not written by a corporation but by a community that refused to die.

From there the era grew.
Skavenblight Gazette rallied the ratmen and became an undisputed leader. And from Tilea came Gold & Glory, the last great banner of the mercenaries, stitched together with pride and desperation in equal measure.

These were not simple PDFs.
They were acts of rebellion.
Declarations that no army would be forgotten so long as one fan still drew breath and had a half-functional copy of Adobe Acrobat.

It was a wild age. A mad age.
An age driven by passion instead of polish, by camaraderie instead of clout. It burned fast and bright and left its scars, some of them literal. The Word of Hashut was not the first ezine, yet its impact may have been the mightiest.

And now, years later, the time has come to tell its story.

Now that I have your attention. As many of you know, my name is Willmark, Editor-in-Chief of Word of Hashut. And after a time, I also served as Editor-in-Chief of the ezine Gold & Glory for the Dogs of War, two of the armies abandoned by Games Workshop from seventh edition onward.

Here is the inside story of the Warhammer ezine era you never knew existed.

We are coming up on fifteen years since the last issue of the Word of Hashut. In many ways it seems like yesterday; in others it feels like a lifetime. My life has changed, my children have grown, and now there is an old man staring back at me in the mirror each morning.

Before all that, a frazzled, time-starved Chaos Dwarf enthusiast worked many nights into the small hours to produce the Word of Hashut. Looking back, it is a blur but also a heady time, when nothing constrained us. Games Workshop had forsaken the Chaos Dwarfs, but the fans had not.

Before we take even the first step, it is important to point out the landscape as it existed. The Word of Hashut was not the first ezine or webzine to exist, far from it. Several came before. In fact, the Word of Hashut would arrive later in the overall scene.

Faction

Ezine

Years

Issues

Chaos Dwarfs

Word of Hashut

2008–2012

12

Skaven

Skavenblight Gazette

2007–2011

11

Vampire Counts

The Invocation

2008–2012

12

Ogre Kingdoms

Bellower

2008–2011

8

Dogs of War

Gold & Glory

2009–2010

3

Dark Elves

Druchii Herald

2005–2007

3

High Elves

Citizen’s Levy

2008–2009

3

Dwarfs

Doomseeker

2008–2010

3

Orcs & Goblins

Waaagh! Magazine

~2006–2008

~4

Wood Elves

Asrai Lookout

2009–2010

2

Chaos Dwarfs (proto)

Word of Hashut Holiday Specials

2008–2011

2

Dogs of War (minor)

Tilean Dispatch / 6th Column

2009–2011

2–4

There they are. When viewed now, the list seems shorter than it felt at the time. Perhaps memory plays tricks. There always seemed to be a great deal of activity across the various forums, and always a new ezine being launched or announced. I know; I was on the primary site for each faction daily back then. Likely there were more ideas than finished projects, and the effort required proved greater than most expected.

I think I can speak to that. I handled the layouts and the Editor-in-Chief roles for two ezines. More on that soon, but it seemed wise to first set the stage before we dive in. It was a wild and wonderful age in which fans banded together to create something Games Workshop had forgotten: a hobby magazine rather than a glorified sales catalog.

The ezines had something White Dwarf did not — a soul, and it showed.

Next up: The Dawn of the Ezines, Part II.

For reference, the current Chaos Dwarfs Online site: https://discourse.chaos-dwarfs.com/

Saturday, June 17, 2017

What's on the painting bench?

Like a lot of wargamers/painters I've got a dirty secret. What is that you ask? Far more lead and plastic to paint than time. Just take a look at what is on the painting desk sitting in the "bull pen" area as it were. Show of hands who is just like me? Its said that 50% of gamer/painters admit to having way more minis to paint than time to paint them all. The other 50% is lying.

An even dirtier secret? This picture doesn't include all of my dark elves that are being repainted.And a dirtier secertx2? This doesn't include about 2-3,000 unpainted 4th through 6th edition High Elves, or terrain that is fully created but not yet painted! Arrrghhhh.



In away this post touches on one of the most ironic things about the hobby. When I was younger I had more time than money for miniatures (still did pretty well). Now that I'm older I have less time, but more money (comparatively speaking) for the hobby. Now the prices have of course gone up! Some days you're the bug, other days the windshield.

Included in the photo are (some highlights)
  • 2 Dragonmasters (one is mostly painted- an old butterfly wing conversion. Only the rider needs to be redone- He'll most like go to my 3rd Edition in progress Wood Elf Host). 
  • 16 chaos warriors on foot
  • 20 3rd edition hobgoblin warriors (including Baron Brightgore)
  • 4 dwarf units 
  • 18 (at the moment) Glade Guards to be utilized as Warrior Kinbands.
To close  I'd like so say I'm doing well shifting through my mountain of lead and plastic but who knows? I'm having fun, that's the main part, but I'd like to make some "progress". Yeah I know, Denial is just a river in Egypt either...

Wednesday, December 25, 2019

Part X of the Repainting my 3rd Edition Wood Elf Force - Elven Lords

While I have not blogged about it lately, I have been diligently working on my 3rd Edition Wood Elf force since Spring. So much so that even though I am going to post about a single unit today, my Elven Lords cavalry unit — it is actually not the only one complete.

In order, I have finished the following which will be in the next blog entry(ies):

  • Beastmasters (just the animals and I had to get creative, those guys go for $$$).
  • Another treeman
  • Wizards, 1 on foot and 2 mounted.
  • 2nd Wardancer unit of 10
  • Army Standard Bearer
  • Bears Monstrous Host
  • A Shape Changer — a Werebear
  • Another unit of 20 archers!
  • Baggage! Only three elves, but I need to find more "elf villager" types anyways.

In short, my Wood Elf army is pretty much complete outside of some Falconer ideas which I may or may not get to and a unit of eight Glade Runners (scouts) made from left over minis from Archer units. Along with that I need to get the actual beast master elves as well for the beastmaster units. If I had to add up the points off the top of my head, it is at least 5,000, especially with the dragon. Not bad for a force that started as allies for my Empire army and was maybe around 800 points back then.


But onward to the meat of the post, the Elven Lords which gives this blurb from the Warhammer Armies book:

"The Lords of Elven communities and their noble retainers ride magnificent warhorses into battle. Wood elves favor roan and dappled horses, plaiting their manes and ornamenting their bridles with hair-plumes and jewels."

Like Mike McVey with his Elven Lord unit featured in White Dwarf #141I did not want to have too uniform of an appearance, but I did not vary them as much as he did. Because of this and the fact that I wanted the flexibility to field them as Wood Riders if I so chose I kept them uniform to the rest of the army. In my imagining of them I take it to be perhaps a single Elven Lord with his retainers, nine in number rather than 10 individual lords.

I decided to keep the horses rustic looking, but uniform with their manes and tails. I did not want to go all gray as to me this seems more like High Elf steeds so I went with more brown horses. Green and white for the bridles with minor variations on the white patterns. Their bases continue with the autumnal turf to convey a middle of the woods late in the year feel that the rest of the army has.

Now some notes on the composition of the unit itself:

  • The champion of the unit: I have disliked the mini since I bought it (around 1990) as I recall. Not sure why, but I think something in the pose struck me as odd. Finally, however, he came together with a paint job I liked this time around.
  • The back row of the unit is of special note. After a single purchase off eBay I was able to round out the unit, but they were not cheap. I had never seen the rider with the mask attached to the helm before and it struck me as unusual.
  • The elf in the front rank with the bow spent a number of years atop a cockatrice for my 4th/5th edition High Elf Army. I debated swapping him out but left him. If I can find some musical instrument "baggage" it will go to him.
  • Several of the elves served as Dragonkin mounted on various dragons for my 3rd Edition High Elf Army when it functioned as a purely dragon force. Real quick — if you wanted, a High Elf player could field an entire army of nothing but dragons... more on that in a post at a later point. Fortunately I kept all the metal horses.
  • The standard bearer I got off of an eBay seller who I do business with quite often. Sometimes pricey, but always reliable. The mini was in rough shape and gobs of paint which I stripped down, primed, painted. The flag itself is inspired from Dark Ages England and I tried to convey an Anglo-Saxon type feel to it while staying with the colors and scheme of the army.

One thing of note is the white spiral pattern on the shields... for some reason on these guys it was a bit wavier than on the other units. Not sure why. I was also short a few shields so I had to use some later edition ones...

Despite all this the unit came out fairly well and are a nice fit for the elites of the army. They did take a bit longer than I expected however.

Next up, as I mentioned and possibly a line on some minis that can stand in for Falconers but that is low on the priority list. Ok so if you ask, I am looking for Bob Olley Half Elves from the Ironclaw line in the late 1980s. They are not cheap however when they come up on eBay and the half elf with the spear cannot be used for the Falconer unit itself.

The next post on the Wood Elf force may be a "catch-all" as I mentioned above encompassing the last units as well as my thoughts on the army, what went well and what I would change with hindsight.